Fabian Ramirez, author of A Kids Book About Anger, talks about how anger can actually be a good thing which leads to impactful change.
Fabian Ramirez, author of A Kids Book About Anger, talks about how anger can actually be a good thing which leads to impactful change.
A Kids Book About Anger (view book)
Full Book Description:
Anger is a part of life—but we never really talk about it other than to say don’t be angry. This is why, too often, kids don’t fully understand what they’re feeling or what to do about it. That’s why this book is here! To help kids understand what it means to feel angry and how to manage and process their anger in healthy and helpful ways that might even inspire positive change.
About the Author:
Fabian Ramirez is an anti-bullying speaker for schools and conferences. He lives in Washington, DC with his wife and 2 children. Connect at: FabianRamirez.com
*If you want to be on a future episode of A Kids Book About: The Podcast or if you have a question you’d like us to consider, have a grownup email us at listen@akidsco.com and we’ll send you the details.
A Kids Book About: The Podcast
S2 EP22, Fabian Talks About Anger
[INTRODUCTION]
Matthew: What is anger?
Jonah: Anger is something everybody feels that can mean like you clutch your anger is something that everybody feels and it's the meaning of. clenching your hands feeling the need to scream or cry or, you know, put something out on someone
Fabian: So anger is an emotion that comes up when people feel that they've been hurt by a person or a situation. And a lot of times we don't even see it coming, but there are little baby steps that actually happen that get us to that strong emotion.
Sometimes we start off as sad, but eventually whenever, um, that emotion is left with us, feeling with it within ourselves. Ultimately the end result is us getting so mad that we're just uncontrollable and it becomes anger. And so anger is something that is uncontrollable. It's hard to control.
Eventually something is going to happen. There's going to be some kind of a peak that will happen with that emotion.
Matthew: Welcome to A Kids Book About: The Podcast! I’m Matthew. I’m a teacher, a librarian, and I’m your host. The voices you heard just a moment ago were from Jonah and Fabian.
Each week we talk about the big things going on in your world with a different author from our A Kids Book About series.
Fabian: Hi, my name is Fabian Ramirez. I am a Hispanic husband, father of two daughters, Eden and Ava. And I am the author of A Kid's Book About Anger.
[TOPIC FOUNDATION]
Matthew: Hey, listeners! It feels unusual to be bringing up the topic of anger with you, because usually we only talk about anger when we’re angry. Right?
But actually, talking about anger when your body is resting or happy is a great opportunity to reflect on how you react when angry and to understand what’s going on in your body when you respond to something in anger. Because, believe you me, anger is something we all feel. And we all feel anger lots and lots of different ways.
Fabian: So anger can feel like a lot of different things, but for one it can feel very hot. You can almost feel it within your face. Um, it's you can read people's body language.
You know, people are always giving you information just by looking at them. And anger is one of those that you can tell when someone's about to get angry. We almost feel it within our gut when we're around someone that is about to get very angry.
And that's why even like the animal kingdom has emotions, too. And so the animal kingdom will actually feel, um, those strong emotions, especially when they feel threatened. And so if you ever watched those shows, those animals, when the animal are like drinking, uh, out of like a pond, you know, and let's just say it's a deer. Well, that deer, when they feel threatened, their head pops up and then they just take off running real fast. Why? Because they feel that gut feeling, you know? And we as humans, we also feel that. Now, if we ignore that, you know, we get eaten, so to speak, just like that deer. If that deer ignores it, we, they get eaten as well.
So that gut feeling that we all have, we can sense it around the people around us. So we know when someone's about to get angry and the end result of that, especially if they don't, if they don't know how to control it, we will ultimately feel the anger that's going to come out. And it's going to come out in whatever way that person that's at.
Matthew: So, if that’s what anger can feel like, let’s consider what it can look like. I’m guessing you have not had much experience with looking at yourself when you’re angry, seeing what your body looks like. But I bet you’ve noticed when someone around you is angry. Can you remember what they looked like when they were in the middle of that big emotion?
Jonah, one of our listeners, asked this question.
[LISTENER QUESTION]
Jonah: How serious can anger get?
Fabian: You know, ultimately it can get physical. Um, and a lot of times we see that because it's external.
And so when someone gets physical, it's something that we can see. They're doing it. There's their, their, their body’s either swinging.
You know, that's why I like to teach kids, you know, fights, don't start off as fights. They always start off with something else that kind of escalates into a fight. But again, that's external.
What happens, what we don't see is very engaged. As when we internalize some of those emotions, when we do that, ultimately it needs to come out in some way. So what that looks like is letting that uncontrollable anger that we have inside come out. And sometimes it comes out externally in the way of like fights. It comes out with a scream, a shout, um, and, and, and, and, and ultimately it, it ends up hurting someone else, including ourselves.
Matthew: I’m going to be asking you to do a lot of reflecting throughout this episode, listeners. Because, again, I’m assuming that you’re not listening to this while angry.
And that’s probably a good thing, because when you’re angry it’s often a lot harder to hear others words or to concentrate on things beyond yourself and the thing that made you angry.
So, let’s reflect. How does your anger make you feel? Turn to a sibling, friend, or grownup if you’re listening together. Or think the answer to yourself. You can even share aloud to me. I might not be able to exactly hear it, but I promise I’m listening.
While you reflect, Fabian shares how anger makes him feel.
Fabian: Well, whenever anger comes up, it often makes you feel scared. And, and the reason why it makes you feel that because we don't like to be out of control.
It is not normal for us to be out of control in whatever way. Whether it's eating or whether it's laughing, like if you've ever had uncontrollable laughter like it's hard to stop, you know? And it's fun laughing. I'm not, I love that you get that gut busting humor, but then the, the other side of that spectrum is having uncontrollable anger. You see? And that's why we can get very scared in the, in those moments because it's not.
Our best does not come out, especially if we're use it for, we're not using it for good. Uh, and I know we're going to get to how we can use it to good, but when you use it to hurt other people, that's when you're not using it for good. And that's when ultimately…
There's a lot of people who get in trouble and little kids get in trouble at school because they don't control their anger. A lot of kids get sent home because they don't control their anger. Or they get sent into that class that where, where, where, kids who don't act good, you know, and like in school suspension and they spend some time there. And so there's a lot of kids that end up going into like in-school suspension, uh, because they just didn't know how to control it. And, and it makes them scared.
[PERSONAL CONNECTION TO TOPIC]
Matthew: It’s time for a stretch. But before we go, I want to reiterate that it is okay to feel anger and to be angry. But it can be dangerous to you and to others to stay angry. Keeping that in mind will serve you your whole life. In fact, Fabian had this story to share that he’s kept with him ever since he was kid.
Fabian: Growing up, my, my, my parents would take me to church and one thing that the pastor one time said is don't ever go to sleep being angry. And I never, I never forgot that, you know, like, don't let the sun go down in your anger and because a lot can happen. There's a lot of change that happens within you. And so when you allow that to happen over night, you don't sleep well, you don't do well. You wake up and you're, you're, you're scared.
But man, that's why we can resolve that kind of anger before you even go to bed. That's one of the best things you can do as a kid. That way you wake up refreshed and you're ready to go to school and face the day.
Matthew: Let’s take a quick break. And when we return, Fabian shares how sometimes anger can be a good thing for motivating us to change things. All of that, right after this quick break.
[BREAK]
Matthew: Welcome back to A Kids Book About: The Podcast. On today’s episode we’re talking about anger with A Kids Book About author Fabian Ramirez.
So, up until this point we’ve talked about how anger is an emotion that could get us into trouble. It can lead to being out of control. It can push us toward decisions or actions that we may regret.
But sometimes, according to Fabian, anger might be just the motivation we need.
Fabian: Absolutely. You know, if my daughter was to get very angry, my first response sometimes as I, as a father is to say, “Wait, you need to check your emotion.” You know. Why? Because I know were what that can lead to. Um, and so we can often see that as a bad thing, but it can be a good thing. How can that be? How can anger ever be a good thing? That's the question, right?
And the way that can be a good thing? Let's just say, as I'm driving home, I'm always seeing like the same person that is asking for money at the red light. Or, um, when I see litter on the ground, for example, and it doesn't make my drive home very peaceful and I'm like, oh, I can't believe someone left a mattress there. I can't believe someone left. You know, we can always see people just dumping litter onto the side of the road. Well, that can make me angry, but what can I do with that anger?
Well, instead of getting so angry that, you know, I also throw stuff out of the window. What if I say, “Oh, I'm going to reach out to my neighbors” and I'm going to, I'm going to use them and say "This makes me very angry. The fact that I can't come home into a nice neighborhood and I've always seen litter on the ground. Why don't we all get together? And we spend a Saturday and we're going to clean this place up and not, and not only that, we're going to go the extra mile where every week I'm going to be in charge of that block. To the next week, the next guy's going to be in charge. And we're always going to make sure that that area is always clean.”
You see that? And so then, then what happens is you make your, you end up making your whole neighborhood beautiful and guess who wins the whole neighborhood wins? How did they win? Because I decided one day I was gonna use my anger for good. I was going to turn around and make sure that it sparked some kind of a change within the neighborhood. And so now, because I decided to get angry about one thing, now I can, I can get people around me to rally around having a clean neighborhood.
That's just one example because we see it all the time.
Matthew: And it doesn’t just stop at being a motivator. Sometimes anger is what helps us to identify places where things are not fair or not right. Anger can be a tool for justice.
Fabian: You know, when you show up to school, if you don't feel safe to be at school, that should make you angry. It should make you angry to a point where you're like, man, this is, this is the school culture that I go to school in? And school culture is what kids allowed to happen on, on campus at school sometimes. Yes, it is what the principal or the teachers, the rules that they put into place that kind of sets the tone. But at the end of the day, the school culture is what kids are allowed to happen.
So, like, for example, if you see your friend get picked up, um, that should make you angry to the point where, man, “I want to change the school culture, because I don't want to show up at a school where these things are happening around me. I want to show up at a school where I feel safe, my friends feel safe. And so it makes me angry to a point where I'm going to, I'm going to rally around, you know, that kid is getting picked on and I'm going to make sure that kid doesn't get picked on any longer by, by getting those adults who love us. And let them know about what's going on so that this behavior doesn't continue.”
You see?
Fabian: You become an upstander. And so when you do that, other people, they rally behind you because you decided to stand up or people.
Matthew: A Kids Book About Anger is a really special one, to me, because Fabian’s words actually spoke right to me, as a grownup. We mentioned before break about not going to bed angry. He writes, “When your anger becomes uncontrollable, it can make you do or say things you will regret later. It can even lead you to hurting yourself or others, which is why it’s important not to let your emotions control you.”
Letting go of your anger may be harder for some of you, and that’s okay. I asked Fabian if he could share with all of you listeners the tips that he’s included in A Kids Book About Anger. And I hope that hearing these helps some of you, and that you know you can come back to this conversation if you need to hear Fabian’s words again.
Fabian: Yeah. Let's start with that first one. The biggest one, it says, “Pause and take deep breaths.” So let's do that together right now, Matthew.
All right. So let's pause, take a deep breath release. See, that is so easy to say, but when you do it, you feel it and it calms you down. Why? You're not going, going, going, going. You stop for a second, but it helps you to recognize the space that you're in and it helps you to realize, okay, before you take an action, when you pause, that's when you just kind of just stop you, take a deep breath. And what you're doing is you're reminding your brain that you're alive and you're breathing. And so when you do that, you're like, yes, I can. I need to be, I need to be careful. I need to be patient with myself, you know?
It's like, it's like having, they say that the, the greatest investment you can make is within yourself. Okay, well, if that's true and what better time than to start whenever you reach that uncontrollable place, and you say, take that deep breath. You pause. And you're like, “Oh man, how can I? My next action, the next thing I do or say, people will remember me by, you know, and what do, what do I want people to remember me by?”
If you're in front of your teacher and you're angry about something. How would you want to be remembered? Because a lot of times people remember you by the last interaction that they have with you and the last time you saw them, that's why you always want to be, uh, kind and loving towards people because people are like, well, next time they think about you or see your name on a piece of paper, they're going to think, “Man, Matthew is so kind. He's, he's just a loving guy. I mean, every time I'm around him, he just exudes greatness.”
You see? It's not going to be, “Man. That guy doesn't know how to control his anger. Last time I was around him, he's very unstable. And then it's hard to be around Matthew because he's an unstable person. I mean, he lets the anger go out of control and he doesn't know how to control it.” You see?
And so as, as kids, when again, you learn how to. And then once you, view that you become emotionally healthy. And when people are around you, you become a safe person. So when you're in the room, you light up the room. My friend used to say, “When you're in the room, you can do two things. Number one, you either change the room or you let the room change you.”
And so when you're emotionally healthy and you're in the classroom, man, you get to be a room changer. You get to change. That's an opportunity to change the room. So again, that's where anger can kind of spark that, that change where it's like, man, let's use this for good. And man, people are going to rally around you and you become the room changer you're supposed to be.
Matthew: If you’re a long-time listener of the show, you know that I always like to close our time together by taking our topic and focusing on how we can be of service and support to others.
We close today with Fabian sharing how each of us can support one another when others are struggling with their anger.
Fabian: I took some, some PhD courses and one of the things I did is I, I did a study on like emotional intelligence. And emotional intelligence is just basically helping people understand, uh, how you're feeling. It's almost like naming your emotions.
And then, and that is a, one of the best things that we can do for people. And it's hard because a lot of people don't, you always, we always don't want it. We don't want to project anything negative onto other people, but at some, if it's something that is helpful. People respect it.
And so for us to be able to say, “Listen, when you do this to me, it makes me feel like this.” In other words, being able to name that emotion or that feeling that happens whenever you do something towards me. And a lot of times where it's easy for us to say when, when it's, when it's good, when it's negative, when it's happy, right? Like, “Hey, whenever you said that about me, that really made me feel good. Thank you so much. I appreciate that.”
Well, it's hard for us to say, “Hey, whenever you call me that name, that really hurt my feelings.” Why because we're, we don't want to make the other person feel bad. And that's why some kids say like, “I don't want to be a snitch. I don't want to say anything. Cause I don't want to get that other guy in trouble.” You see?
And so it's, they're thinking about it all wrong. We gotta, we gotta get back to a point where we can say feel free to name that emotion that you have. Cause why? Because you're helping people. Cause it's our job to train people how we want to be treated. And so when we don't train people, how we want to be treated, they continue to call us names. They continue to walk, walk over us and it makes us angry.
And so we need to get to a point where we can name it and say, “This is how I'm feeling when you do this, or when you say this.” And when we do that, they'll respect our, our circle where we're at. And when they are invited into our circle, now they know how to treat us. And when, when they do otherwise, they know the expectations up front. So we can say, “Hey, I thought I already mentioned that I didn't like for you to be calling me that, you know?”
And so I think it's appreciated on the other end, but it takes a lot out of us to do it, but when you do it, you feel better. It's like you stand up for yourself too. Yeah. I love being an upstander and standing up for other people, but I don't want to do it at the point where I'm just getting run over myself. You know, I want to be able to stand up for myself as well.
And so when you do that, you show up for yourself. And because of that, you become that much more healthy for other people.
[CLOSING]
Matthew: Thank you to Fabian Ramirez, author of A Kids Book About Anger, for joining us today. And special thanks to Jonah for lending their voice to this episode.
Jonah: Hi, my name is Jonah. I am 12 years old and I live in Maryland.
Matthew: Want to be on a future episode of A Kids Book About: The Podcast? Write to me or record a message and email me at listen@akidsco.com.
A Kids Book About: The Podcast is written, edited, and produced by me, Matthew Winner, with help from Chad Michael Snavely and the team at Sound On Studios. Our executive producer is Jelani Memory.
And this show was brought to you by A Kids Co.
Follow the show wherever podcasts are found and check out other podcasts made for kids just like you by visiting akidsco.com.
Join us next week for a conversation about school shootings with A Kids Book About author Crystal Woodman Miller.